Transcript of Voice of Community chat

Topic: VOC meeting #7
Date: April 10th, 2009
Time: 4:00 PM Central European Time
Duration: 1 hour
Conversation: netbeans
Chat Client: NetBeans Developer Collaboration module
Participants:
  • Tushar Joshi (India)
  • Melongo Annabel (USA)
  • Jiri Kovalsky (Czech Republic)

  • Agenda:
    1. Update: Plugin Portal outages [Jiri, 5 minutes]
    2. Discussion: Outstanding potential VOC issues [Annabel (J2ME&J2EE), Tushar (RCP&Core) 45 minutes]
    3. Q&A [all, 10 minutes]

    Minutes:

  • Jiri updated VOC captains on recent responsiveness problems of Plugin Portal, nobody is aware of any complaints from community so far.
  • Issues with 6.7_WAIVER_APPROVED keyword will remain not fixed in NetBeans 6.7 e.g. #134990.
  • According to Tushar there are no critical problems concerning RCP at the moment.
  • Tushar pointed out that #152894 with 40 votes is a potential VOC issue.
  • Annabel noticed several requests for Perforce integration.
  • Annabel also wants to know current status of debugging support in WebLogic applications (#65969).
  • In addition to that she saw a need for JavaFX Visual Designer (#161738) and complaints about missing buttons in Search Results window (#119818).
  • Finally, Annabel suggested to look at #13857.
  • Action items:

  • Jiri to ask Petr Heil about status of #152894.
  • Tushar to try reproducing #152894 himself and adding his findings to that issue.
  • Jiri to contact Gregg Wonderly and suggest publishing his Perforce plugin either on Plugin Portal or Update Center.
  • Jiri to talk to Petr Jiricka about #65969
  • Tushar to look at Rectangular Edit Tools plugin and possibly fix #13857.
  • 4:01:51tusharvjoshi joined the conversation
    4:02:01Jiri Kovalsky Hi Tushar!
    4:02:15Tushar Joshi Hi Jiri
    4:02:30Jiri Kovalsky Annabel is on her way...
    4:02:37Tushar Joshi ok
    4:03:34amelongo joined the conversation
    4:03:48Jiri Kovalsky Hello Annabel!
    4:03:59Annabel Melongo Hi everybody
    4:04:04Jiri Kovalsky Hi Captains, welcome to our VOC chat today! How are you?
    4:04:05Tushar Joshi Hi
    4:04:20Annabel Melongo fine. It's a holy day here today
    4:04:54Jiri Kovalsky Oh, I hope it's not a sin for you to participate in this meeting then. ;-)
    4:05:01Jiri Kovalsky Today's agenda is pretty short. I just wanted to talk about Plugin Portal and then listen to you.
    4:05:02Tushar Joshi :-)
    4:05:07Annabel Melongo really funny...
    4:05:23Jiri Kovalsky :-)
    4:05:27Jiri Kovalsky So, firstly let me share two charts with you. These graphs show that new version of the Plugin Portal is kind of less stable than the previous one.
    4:05:52Jiri Kovalsky Can you see the pictures?
    4:06:25Tushar Joshi Where can I see them?
    4:06:36Annabel Melongo yes, I see them
    4:06:43Tushar Joshi ok I can now
    4:07:33Jiri Kovalsky So, as you can see there is obviously some connectivity/responsiveness issue since March 8th when we deployed new version.
    4:07:46Jiri Kovalsky I am of course monitoring our community myself too but have to say that I haven't noticed any complaints so far.
    4:07:59Annabel Melongo me too
    4:08:02Jiri Kovalsky The only problem was reported by one of our plugin verifiers but that's all. Are you aware of any other critical voices?
    4:08:03Tushar Joshi Yes same here, I havent noticed specific complaints
    4:08:28Annabel Melongo I'm aware of none
    4:08:33Jiri Kovalsky Well, for example on April 6th the Plugin Portal had about 7 outages.
    4:08:51Jiri Kovalsky We are considering possible solutions to that but until more people complain we will most probably don't invest much time into this.
    4:09:39Jiri Kovalsky So, that's why I need you to keep your eyes and browsers and e-mail clients wide/electronically open and Fwd: everything you spot concerning this matter.
    4:09:57Annabel Melongo ok
    4:10:16Tushar Joshi ok Jiri, we already talked about this last time but again will keep an eye on this
    4:10:51Jiri Kovalsky Sure. I brought it here again because of the Monday's problems.
    4:11:10Jiri Kovalsky Now, let's go to the VOC part.
    4:11:37Jiri Kovalsky Tushar, why don't you start...
    4:11:42Tushar Joshi yes
    4:12:25Tushar Joshi Issue: #134990 (26)p2 has been flagged as 6.7_WAIVER_APPROVED does that mean this issue will not be worked on till 6.7 is released?
    4:12:50Jiri Kovalsky Looking at this...
    4:12:53Tushar Joshi http://www.nabble.com/NetBeans-7.0-- td20832643.html
    4:12:58Tushar Joshi http://www.nabble.com/NetBeans-7.0--td20832643.html
    4:14:40Jiri Kovalsky Yes, partially. It means that we are not going to fix that in 6.7 timeframe and if there are resources after 6.7 this bug might get fixed then.
    4:15:27Jiri Kovalsky Tushar, did you face this yourself or where did you come across this?
    4:17:06Tushar Joshi I came across this in mailing list, Last two weeks were rough for me as I had to travel a lot and got very little time to work on but I am working on the issue Issue: #133943 (15)p2 to simulate and till now I have not been able to get to such a level that I can complain about the performance.  I will add my comments with screenshots and also wish to blog about this issue about my findings which I will do in the coming week as I become less occupied with the production issues I was facing in the last two weeks
    4:18:18Tushar Joshi There is one more issue I came across in the mailing list posts #152894 (40)p3 Edit/Highlight loop causes 5s-10s EDT pauses http://forums.netbeans.org/topic6973.html Which is not a direct Java issue but Groovy editor issue
    4:19:58Tushar Joshi I am trying to get hold of any issues community is facing for the platform specific parts, what I have seen is the openide and nbdev lists are so uptodate that the community gets answers almost very quickly and there are almost no complaints about the platform as such, if someone else has noticed anything I will be interested to know
    4:21:06Jiri Kovalsky Oh yes, the #133943 is the one you promised to simulate. I am glad you still want to help with this.
    4:23:08Jiri Kovalsky The previous one (#134990) is pretty difficult one and the fact that it has been waived unveils that right now we don't want to destabilize the existing functionality given our tight schedule and low resources.
    4:23:51Jiri Kovalsky Let me look at the Groovy one.
    4:23:57Tushar Joshi About (#134990) I can understand I just wanted to point that issue and know whether it will be kept for post 6.7
    4:24:23Jiri Kovalsky Yes, that's right.
    4:24:58Jiri Kovalsky Tushar, which mailing list was that?
    4:25:17Tushar Joshi nbusers
    4:25:26Tushar Joshi http://forums.netbeans.org/topic6973.html
    4:25:27Jiri Kovalsky The URL does not work...
    4:26:06Jiri Kovalsky Oh, looks like nabble.com is down.
    4:26:42Annabel Melongo No it's not
    4:27:03Tushar Joshi I havent seen this issue myself but this issue has 40 votes and a thread on the users list
    4:27:30Jiri Kovalsky Yes, this one looks serious.
    4:27:47Jiri Kovalsky I will surely ask Petr Hejl about it.
    4:28:25Tushar Joshi Ok , and I will add this issue in my follow up list and even I can try doing some projects like mentioned in the thread
    4:28:29Jiri Kovalsky Luckily "hippy" provided the FTD which might help.
    4:29:21Jiri Kovalsky Yes, great. So, we have two AIs. I will talk to Petr and you please try to replicate that.
    4:29:33Tushar Joshi ok
    4:30:07Jiri Kovalsky I don't do any Groovy development myself, so cannot be of any help. The steps to reproduce don't look that scientific though...
    4:30:17Jiri Kovalsky What's next Tushar? Or are you done?
    4:31:32Tushar Joshi Regarding the issues I have only these ones, on a side note there was some panic about the IBM thing which happened in the community over last two weeks, if appropriate can you comment something on it here?
    4:32:59Jiri Kovalsky Well, for obvious reasons I can't comment on this. However, if you watch the news you know everything I know.
    4:33:17Jiri Kovalsky What do you think about it?
    4:33:47Tushar Joshi yes I know, I think as NetBeans has a backing of large community, no one can shake it easily . so lets move towards Annabel
    4:35:02Jiri Kovalsky Yes, I have already heard one NetBeans Dream Team member that it's the right time to clone repository and fork NetBeans ... ;-)
    4:35:43Annabel Melongo I don't get the joke...
    4:36:33Jiri Kovalsky Yes, I agree Annabel. It's rather sad...
    4:37:01Jiri Kovalsky So, can you share with us your findings?
    4:38:39Annabel Melongo Ok; let's come back to things we master. personally though, I HATE IBM; I interviewed once with them and I had to know some proprietary things that people outside of IBM never heard of.... since then I made a definite divorce with that company. Now my issues....
    4:40:08Jiri Kovalsky Well, I have heard that the differences in company cultures are big. I have one friend in IBM though and he is quite approachable.
    4:41:08Annabel Melongo My first issue is the need for NB to support perforce version control: #67259 This came in last week in the nbusers mailing list and I made of note.
    4:41:35Jiri Kovalsky Let me look at the Perforce issue ...
    4:42:53Jiri Kovalsky I can't find it in the list.
    4:43:44Annabel Melongo you can't? It's issue: #67259
    4:44:19Jiri Kovalsky I mean I don't see any debate on the nbusers list.
    4:44:43Annabel Melongo wait I'll look for it
    4:45:20Jiri Kovalsky Hm, it's neither on our Update Center nor Plugin Portal.
    4:45:29Jiri Kovalsky Why does not he simply publish the work there?
    4:46:07Jiri Kovalsky I am talking about Gregg Wonderly - author of the Perforce plugin: http://www.wonderly.org/netbeans
    4:46:50Annabel Melongo ok; I thought you were talking about nbusers mailing list
    4:46:57Jiri Kovalsky Oh, it looks actually cool! Somebody should contact him!
    4:47:26Jiri Kovalsky Yes, but it does not matter now. I found an URL in the bug report linking to Gregg's site.
    4:48:27Jiri Kovalsky OK, I will approach him and suggest to get this on the PP or maybe even official UC! Thanks for the pointer Annabel!
    4:48:44Jiri Kovalsky What's next?
    4:49:47Annabel Melongo The next issue is about not being able to debug any application created with weblogic server: #65969
    4:50:16Jiri Kovalsky What's the source in this case? Again nbusers?
    4:51:02Jiri Kovalsky Hm, that's bad. Libor Kotouc (currently assigned) is no longer with Sun.
    4:51:29Annabel Melongo Nobody to replace him?
    4:52:42Jiri Kovalsky The J2EE team was severely impacted by the recent layoffs. We have many modules which are not only in sustaining mode but unmaintained completely.
    4:53:17Jiri Kovalsky How did you come across this? It's pretty ancient issue.
    4:53:30Annabel Melongo complaints...
    4:53:46Annabel Melongo then I went to issuezilla and I found it
    4:54:15Jiri Kovalsky I see. Did you suggest those complainers to add a comment to that issue and vote for it?
    4:54:38Annabel Melongo I don't think I did.
    4:54:53Jiri Kovalsky Looking at that issue it seems noone is seriously interested ...
    4:56:42Jiri Kovalsky But, I can ask responsible manager at least.
    4:57:10Annabel Melongo ok. Update us then. My next issue is about....
    4:57:20Jiri Kovalsky Sure, I will.
    4:57:59Annabel Melongo The need for a visual designer for javafx: #161738
    5:01:20Jiri Kovalsky Yes, as you can read in the comment from Ryan de Laplante there is a work being done right now. I can confirm this.
    5:01:44Jiri Kovalsky Will you be attending JavaOne?
    5:01:59Annabel Melongo where will it be?
    5:02:18Jiri Kovalsky San Francisco.
    5:02:26Annabel Melongo when?
    5:03:11Jiri Kovalsky June 2-5 http://java.sun.com/javaone
    5:03:56Annabel Melongo I might. I will look at my work schedule and see how to accodomote. Any link to this question?
    5:04:04Jiri Kovalsky Plus some university session from May 31st.
    5:04:35Jiri Kovalsky What link do you mean?
    5:05:06Annabel Melongo What the relation between attending JavaOne and the JavaFx editor?
    5:06:01Jiri Kovalsky See Ryan's last comment.
    5:06:19Jiri Kovalsky Anyway, I will have to double check this if you want to be sure.
    5:06:57Annabel Melongo Ok, now I see. Thanks for the clarification...
    5:07:22Jiri Kovalsky Great. Do you have more issues today?
    5:07:40Annabel Melongo I still have two... Should I go on?
    5:07:49Jiri Kovalsky OK, why not?
    5:07:55Annabel Melongo ok
    5:08:43Jiri Kovalsky However, if you send them on Thursday next time I will be able to gather more information...
    5:08:53Annabel Melongo The next issue is about the sort search button that was existing in the past NB versions but that's missing now: #119818
    5:08:54Jiri Kovalsky ... for the VOC meeting.
    5:09:51Jiri Kovalsky Oh, yes. That's one of the issues for the NetFIX team. You can implement it yourself Annabel!
    5:10:44Jiri Kovalsky However, Andrey said that he had no time for this.
    5:10:57Annabel Melongo The last issue is about copying and cutting block of texts. Actually there's a plugin that can do that, but there were some complaints about it last week; this issue has being since 2001: #13857
    5:12:58Jiri Kovalsky Yes, that's Sandip Chitale's plugin.
    5:13:32Jiri Kovalsky He is again no longer with Sun. It will be hard to convince him to fix that bug.
    5:13:44Jiri Kovalsky New plugin owner would be welcomed.
    5:14:16Tushar Joshi Can anyone become a owner of such plugin?
    5:14:22Annabel Melongo That's why you shouldn't lay off people!!!
    5:14:29Jiri Kovalsky Yes, I can approve that.
    5:14:46Tushar Joshi Hey Sandeep switched earlier than this layoffs I think
    5:15:12Jiri Kovalsky Annabel, it's not me laying off people.
    5:15:31Tushar Joshi I will have a look at the plugin today if I can do something in that code then, please add this as my action point
    5:16:06Jiri Kovalsky OK, it's your AI Tushar.
    5:16:56Tushar Joshi I am already working with one of his plugin for copying the paths and exploring system explorer named some Copy Path plugin
    5:17:01Jiri Kovalsky If you face some obstacles, let me know. However, maybe you just need to contact Sandip. His last words are: "I plan to continue to support my NetBeans modules as an open source contributor."
    5:17:37Tushar Joshi actually I also know Sandeep through one of my friends so yes i will contact Sandeep
    5:18:14Jiri Kovalsky Great. Thanks Annabel for bringing this issue to our attention and Tushar for proactively working on that!
    5:18:36Jiri Kovalsky Anything else today?
    5:18:48Tushar Joshi done from my side
    5:19:23Annabel Melongo On my part no. A question though, I was just wondering, I know it's not a holiday in India today, what about Czeck Rep.?
    5:19:37Jiri Kovalsky To be honest with you I was expecting you to have a talk about #161033 today. Luckily it was fixed finally!
    5:20:39Jiri Kovalsky It's not holiday here today. We are having Easter on Monday!
    5:20:56Annabel Melongo You're Kidding? Are you?
    5:21:20Jiri Kovalsky No, I am not kidding. Why do you think so?
    5:21:39Annabel Melongo Easter is on Sunday... Not Monday...
    5:21:49Tushar Joshi Even if its not holiday in India, I am currently in New York and hence at home.  I will be back to India from 20th Apr 09
    5:22:00Jiri Kovalsky We celebrate it on Monday here. We will have a public holiday.
    5:22:25Annabel Melongo Please explain... why do you celebrate Easter on Monday?
    5:22:32Jiri Kovalsky Great, so the next meeting is scheduled for April 24th, 4:00 p.m. CET.
    5:22:48Jiri Kovalsky Annabel, can we discuss this offline via e-mail?
    5:23:22Annabel Melongo Sure. I'm really curious.. Have a nice holiday then. Tushar, nice to know that you're in the US.
    5:23:47Jiri Kovalsky Great, so thank you for joining us today. And thanks for the feedback!
    5:24:04Jiri Kovalsky Have a nice weekend.
    5:24:20Tushar Joshi Have a nice weekend all!
    5:24:27Annabel Melongo Nice Easter...Also nice MOnday Easter
    5:24:34Jiri Kovalsky Bye


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